I am delighted to announce the addition of two new critters to my family: Charlotte and Lucy. They are six-month-old hooded rats. Has anybody here ever trained their rats to perform in a magic show? I realize that Charlotte and not babies, so perhaps they are too old to become performers. And they are my daughter's -- not mine -- and I'm not sure she wants them to get involved with the entertainment business. But I still might be interested in teaching them a few tricks.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4095/4883838608_521bbae26b_m.jpg


http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4073/4883839422_c8b24ae30b_m.jpg

I think I have a name for the magic show. The rat in the hat.

After seeing my friend do stage show with dove, and bringing out dead dove that was shocking, but his recovery was great so it did not scar the public, as he taking the bird off stage to dump him off, he was flipping the wings with his fingers causing to look like all ok. But yes the rat would be able to be trained, mater of fact thank you for the idea for my non-clown performance with rat would be great accompany dead prospect puppet on stage so he just stays on the puppet, a little nip on the fingers when I try to touch it might just add to Awwwwwww, ouch, oh know, to the whole thing, Thanks for insert got me thinking about it now.

Great Pickles, But I think you'll have to go HOBO if you do this. Cute pictures though.
Sara K.

I'm thinking of some things I could do with a rat that wouldn't even require training. I have one of those Rabbit Wringer props, where you insert the bunny, turn the crank, supposedly flatten the rabbit, and then remove a flattened version. My current rabbit is way too chunky to fit in this prop, but I see no reason why my child's rats wouldn't work. I make sure the kids know that I didn't really squish the critter.

Special Kz, thank you for telling me how cute my -- I mean my kid's -- rats are. I just love that picture of Lucy peeking over the footboard. I see no reason why Pickles can't have rats in her show. I think I'm gonna do it.

Alpha, let me know if you decide to proceed with the rat idea. Would love to hear more about what you do with it.

Mature rats will train well enough; maybe even better than their younger counterparts. Adult rats (like people) have a longer attention span. Are they male or female? How old?

Even old rats who have never had an attempt at training before can learn simple tricks. Make sure you make the training fun (for both you and the rat), when the rat isn't tired, and reward it well (find out what treats they like). If they seem to be getting bored, change the activity or take a break (over-training and all). If they're older I'm assuming they've been socialized well enough; if not, take some time to allow them to become comfortable with you before you try to teach them a trick.

Jolly Well,

First of all, it's great having you back! I've enjoyed your posts from the past few days.

I take it from your comments that you have worked with rats in the past. Have you ever performed with them?

Lucy and Charlotte are six months old. They were involved with some behavioral studies in a previous life and know how to push a lever to get food. We've only had them for a few days, so they are still getting settled into their four-story luxury penthouse. They seem to be very social, intelligent, and sweet-tempered. :)

Thanks.

No performances with animals for me. Animal rights wacko, remember? ;)
Just an interest in them as they're remarkably intelligent. An old acquaintance of my family use to work with an animal rescue group and came across some at one time, whether they were rescues or pets I know not, but the animal was inquisitive enough regardless. Also, years ago a friend use to raise them. It was when I was young (early/mid teens maybe) so I unfortunately don't recall what type they were, but once again they showed an innate intelligence that even when they were randomly scurrying about, they were of interest.

Regrettably, I'm still relatively ignorant about rats as a whole. I don't know one species of them from another really and all but a fraction of my knowledge of them is book based. After the interactions with the rats mentioned above I was curious enough to research care, training, etc. as I was, at the time, interested in keeping a pair on hand as pets. I'd like to tell you that I have vast knowledge and working experience with them, but I never got around to finding the time, space, or energy to bring any home to keep so outside of basic socialization and "starter tricks" I witnessed vicariously, all I can do is point you to the same resources that a good search engine can.

Let us know how it goes though, if I ever get around to adding some to my home I'll look to you for some advice. Unless of course yours end up being crazed and savage, then I may just stick with google. :)

I'm thinking of some things I could do with a rat that wouldn't even require training. I have one of those Rabbit Wringer props, where you insert the bunny, turn the crank, supposedly flatten the rabbit, and then remove a flattened version. My current rabbit is way too chunky to fit in this prop, but I see no reason why my child's rats wouldn't work. I make sure the kids know that I didn't really squish the critter.

Special Kz, thank you for telling me how cute my -- I mean my kid's -- rats are. I just love that picture of Lucy peeking over the footboard. I see no reason why Pickles can't have rats in her show. I think I'm gonna do it.

Alpha, let me know if you decide to proceed with the rat idea. Would love to hear more about what you do with it.
Just one word of caution. You know how kids always want to handle you pets afterwards. Rats go by sense of smell for the most part they are really blind. Some more than others. Well if there is food on a kids hands the rats will nibble on the fingers. Now for someone experienced in handeling them this is not big problem but with kids they get scared and pull back. Then they end up getting a nasty tear in the finger cause the rats tooth will catch when they pull away. It is not that the rat bit them and it is not the rat's fault but if someone handles them their hands have to be clean and free of food smells.
Sara K.

Aww, I think the kids will love it. Trained or not. :)
Children always have a love for animals, more than adults.

Once you finish training these rats, will you please come to Chicago and train some of the ones on our streets not to jump right in front of me at unexpected moments?

That's cute. I like it.

Ah, there's that pesky liability issue. I think my insurance will only cover incidents involving rabbits, dogs, and birds. Okay, on second thought, maybe the twins won't be doing magic shows, but I'm still going to work with them and see if they can learn a few tricks. I'll let you know how it goes.

I was going to try and use mine but didnt want to deal with mothers who thought they were dirty and "keep that filthy thing away from my children!" So I have a bunny... I want a little mouse to train like on the green mile.

i have a rat that looks exactly like a sewer rat, which fits my hobo character...
but yeah parents don't exactly find the idea very amusing...

Mr. BE:

Does your rat do tricks? Is he a part of your act? Please tell me more.

Talk of behaving like adult clowns in another thread and now rats performing tricks for money. What kind of place is this turning into when clowns and pickles are in the gutter? Outrage I say - where is a moderator when you need one?

Not sure if you're interested in another insurance policy, or even how comprehensive the policies are at Allen Insurance Group, but they have a quick form for these very questions on their website (http://www.eqgroup.com/entertainment.htm) if it's worth looking into for you.

Got DVD clips form a guy who used rats in a rat show for parties and circusses. I see if I can download it to the computer, and then not sure if I can get it to clown-forum. I'll let you know.

You should get a pet snake and feed the rat to it as part of your show!

Imm? ! No this thread is becoming a threat.

Ok, Pickles I got the rat act movies but it is in wmv filetype format. Play with Windows Media Player. I do not see this attachment key when I try to load it, and therefore it seems not to load or is going to take a day to load. I will find out what the other keys means and may be I can convert the wmv files to that.

That's cute. I like it.

YouTube - spectacle 2010 des rats et ragondins de Gunter Sacckman Jr (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89w2iO5id2c)

That's a great act StuartPid. The guy in my movies do something similar but this guy rats is faster and more trained. Anyway, I know now that it is to big for downloading so I have to email it.

That is INSANE! Did you see the size of those black rats?! I once worked in a restaurant that had rats that size in it. Eeeew. The little white and black hooded ones -- the cute rats -- look like Lucy and Charlotte though.

Was that really a rat parachuting down from the tower? How did they do that?

Very cool, Sean. Thanks for sharing.

HI Pickles , GOOD NEWS ! your rats are not to old , Rats r very smart ! hold them alot and let them feel safe with you , always call them by thier names so they know who they are. they will come to you just by you calling thier names if you bond with them ,it could take a little while if they havent been held alot . its good to give them treats but wash your hands after u do cause they have a great sence of smell , and might try to nibble at your fingers , i think the best thing to do is put the treat down in front of them , so they don't think your fingers r treats u want to keep hands and treats separate . i was thinking about using mine in my show but they r so big and fat now . i was thinking about getting another baby, u can also train them to jump with a little bell or something that makes a little noise, let me warn u ! they are good jumpers and swimmers when they want to be . the trick i was thinking of was the cup trick , hidding under a cup and when u r not looking he runs to the other cup , you don't see him but the kids do.you will have the kids going nutes ! (just a thought ) lots u can do ! have fun ! God BLESS !

Pickles,

Just curious how the rat training has gone? (if at all).

I got a pair of rescue rats over the winter and have been working with them a bit with moderate success. They currently do: cups & balls - guessing game, tightrope, they "wave" at people, and do a skit where they rescue a "baby" (small toy baby) from a "burning building" (cardboard house with fake fire decorations), along with some very basic and generic tricks that essentially all trained animals begin with.

I don't have them in an act, but tentatively thinking about using the rescue one in an informational way for rescue animals in the future or such.

I do not use rats any longer in my magic shows. I do not like the messy mess they make.

Dynamo,
They can be litter box trained. What mess? Did he chew a hole through your hat? I would think a rabbit or a dove would make bigger messes. Bigger animal means bigger poo poo?
Sara K.

I do not use rats any longer in my magic shows. I do not like the messy mess they make.

Rats are incredibly clean animals. If they were messy beyond control I'd wager it was something on the human end of the partnership causing them to be so. As mentioned above, they can easily be litter box trained and given appropriate chew toys, mess shouldn't be an issue at all.

Dynamo,
They can be litter box trained. What mess? Did he chew a hole through your hat? I would think a rabbit or a dove would make bigger messes. Bigger animal means bigger poo poo?
Sara K.
I am talking about during performance purposes. If you will look on all my pictures and videos of my websites you will notice I only use white colored pets. On my way to my performances my rats would travel in their cases. They begin their pooping. It does not bother them if they would lay on it. It smears on their fur. Even when I make it to my gigs, the rats are set inside of their props. They do not mind pooping inside of it before their appearance time. I did not like like showing the appearance of a white rat with poop stains on it's fur.

Rabbits and chinchillas have quick dry poop instead. If they step on it during travel time, nothing sticks to their fur or feet. A dove's body is high off the base area. When they poop, they never get anything on their feathers.

And rabbits and chinchilla's cages have square holes on the bottom. When they poop, the pellets go thru the screen floor to a base. Doves cages are solid on the bottom, but they usually stay on their perch away from the poop. Rat's cages are solid bottom. Even though wood shavings covers the bottom, they will still lay anywhere to go to sleep.

Sounds like a cage problem to me. Couldn't they make a different type of cage. Or put a small litter box/dish in the corner of the cage. That is weird cause one rat I had would ride on my shoulders for like hours at a time and never went on me. But the minute I put her back in the cage she would go then and I never trained her to do this she just did.
Sara K.

That is INSANE! Did you see the size of those black rats?! I once worked in a restaurant that had rats that size in it. Eeeew. The little white and black hooded ones -- the cute rats -- look like Lucy and Charlotte though.

Was that really a rat parachuting down from the tower? How did they do that?

Very cool, Sean. Thanks for sharing.
and they did not pay you extra?

Sounds like a cage problem to me. Couldn't they make a different type of cage. Or put a small litter box/dish in the corner of the cage. That is weird cause one rat I had would ride on my shoulders for like hours at a time and never went on me. But the minute I put her back in the cage she would go then and I never trained her to do this she just did.
Sara K.

Agreed. The scenario Dynamo posted is a problem because of the human, not the rat. Taking the time to learn about the animal and train it properly goes a long way. Tossing it in a box and expecting it to not do what is natural is ignorant.

Like Sara, my rats ride on my shoulder (pocket, hat, head) and I've never had an episode.

Rats are insanely clean, to the point of nearly constantly grooming (watch them, as soon as you handle the, and then put them down, they feel the need to clean the human grime from themselves), if they have feces on them then there is something you need to change; or, you can just remain in the dark about it and try to remove any accountablilty from yourself

Finding rats relatively easy to train for the most part. Three rats now (rescued male dumbo 2 weeks ago to go along with the albino girls).

Within a day or two they can easily:

-Learn their name and come when called
- "Stand" (upright on hind legs) when asked to do so
- Walk upright
- Spin
- Pull a basket from the floor to a table top by a string (using their hands)
- Fetch (one of the girls won't fetch, personality and attention span details)
- Guessing game (cups and balls)
- Tightrope walk
- "Wave"

Adding a jumping through a hoop soon and I suspect that they could have learned it already had I tried it. Intelligent animals and the training of them seems to require little effort on the human element of the act.

Edit - After just trimming my rats nails for the first time (sort of), I now completely understand all the information about males that aren't neutered sometimes behaving aggressively. With proof of this aggressiveness now having been displayed in person, I'm considering teaching my male dumbo rat how to kill on command.

Cirque du Sewer (http://www.melissaarleth.com/home). The rat acts themselves aren't as entertaining as the earlier spanish version. But the rat handler doesn't pick the rats up by the tail like a d-bag (potentially de-gloving them) either.

You are right about that tail thing. My husband (then boyfriend) was playing around with one when he didn't know much about them and he was afraid it was going to fall. He grabbed it by the end of the tail and hurt it really badly. He felt awful. They can lose part of their tail that way and it isn't pretty. Not a good thing to do.
Sara K.

Do the rats in that show wear odd French costumes and perform to alleged themes which no one actually understands?

Do the rats in that show wear odd French costumes and perform to alleged themes which no one actually understands?

The humans were wearing odd French costumes and performing alleged themes that didn't flow (from the clip). I didn't notice rat costumes but I could imagine it happening in the show. In all actuality the rat show I posted doesn't seem very good (judging from the promo clip), but it has a rat theme that goes with this thread. In the clip the rats didn't seem trained all that well really; and the few tricks that they did you can have your own pet doing within a day or three.

The rats in the earlier Spanish clip did some great stuff and the act as whole seemed entertaining and well polished. My only issue with it really is the tail thing. Rats have a tail that will de-glove, rather easily; sort of like iguanas, it evidently is a feature that will allow the rat to escape capture. However, if the tail loses the covering skin via a de-glove, the tail itself atrophies and will likely either fall off, or need to be amputated. Unlike iguanas, if this happens, it doesn't grow back and it is a handicap for rats. They use their tail for temperature control (they don't sweat through skin) and balance, so it's more than a creepy cosmetic tool, they kind of need it to get around successfully.

Before it's brought up, I realize there are tailless breeds of domestic rats. These guys, like a de-gloved rat (but less painfully) obviously have no tails; the same care and precautions need to be taken with them - cooling devices in their housing, fall-safe structures, etc.

The only thing I don't understand is how you can have a line in you signature saying to support animal free circuses yet you are working on your own trained animal act... Please don't look at this as an attack that is not my intent, it just makes me curious and I'm wondering if you could explain. Also wondering if you would be interested in shooting a little video of how you trained the rats and what they can do I would be VERY interested in seeing that.

I don't have them in an act, but tentatively thinking about using the rescue one in an informational way for rescue animals in the future or such.

No act. "Tentatively thinking" as in, if the opportunity ever arose that would allow people to become educated about rats by seeing them do a few things, then maybe, maybe not. Nothing in the works and something I'm not actively pursuing and not likely to ever do. Thus "tentatively: not agreed upon, concluded, worked out..."

Rats however, do need mental stimulation and training offers that. If left in their cage alone, especially if cage toys aren't changed out every few days to give them something new to experience, they become bored, and often neurotic. Basic learning can also help avoid unnecessary dangers (learning their name, or to come when called for example can help find a "lost" rat, or to remove it from danger from predators).

In light of that, I'll assume you've just skimmed this thread or haven't read it in entirety. Maybe not and text lead you to your conclusion of "The only thing I don't understand is how you can have a line in you signature saying to support animal free circuses yet you are working on your own trained animal act..."

If on the other hand, you're presuming the animals should be left in cage without some sort of mental exercise, then we'll likely have to disagree on the benefits and responsibility of pet ownership.

As for training videos. It's probably something I can put up soon enough. We added a new rat this week. Maybe in the next few weeks as she also is a rescue and in need of vet care for what appears to be respiratory issues from likely being housed with cedar or pine shavings (or another aromatic bedding which sucks for rats). Once she's on the mend, we'll definitely be working with her seeing as she is currently housed alone (quarantine) until it is safe to do an introduction to the other rats.

Dewey doing a basket pull-up. He gets distracted by Ishmael and the smell of food cooking in the adjacent kitchen at one point, but I wasn't going to set down and film numerous takes.

Distractions included, the basic principal is the same. Basket pull ups used in conjunction with a few other tricks and you have yourself a living Goldberg device.

One of the easier tricks for rats to learn. Food reward (organic cereals for us usually - rice krispies or cheerios equivalents work well) and patience. More to follow as time allows...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyJWgsuBJsU

Coming when called and standing up on hind legs are also foundation skills. Knowing to answer a call can remove the rat from a dangerous situation as well as lay the foundation for fetching (which leads to more tricks). "Up" is the starter for dancing, walking upright, waving, pushing carts, strollers, etc and opens the door for more tricks and abilities. Foundation builders all, but completely necessary to have a well trained rat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saZ3UOfXUfA

and a less distracted pull-up (although the "yay" encouragement from Ishmael makes for a better video imo)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPWw1EORhuM